Monday, 31 May 2010

Turkey to benefit from flotilla deaths

Interesting this episode with the Israelis shooting dead stick-wielding Turks (and others?) trying to get 'aid' through to Palestinians in the Gaza Strip.

Firstly, the Turks are experts at using disproportionate force against weaker opponents and then boasting about how tough and brave they are and that death is the just desserts of anyone confronting or insulting Turkdom. The amount of comments from Turks I have to delete on my Youtube videos (see here and here) revelling in the barbaric murder of Solomos Solomou in Dherynia as he tried to take down the Turkish flag reveals the psychopathic and fanatical basis of Turkish identity. So, we note the irony of overwhelmed Turks bemoaning the barbarism of Israel and its readiness to use lethal force in today's incident.

Secondly, the inevitable collapse of Israeli-Turkish relations these killings will provoke suits the purposes of the Turkish government and its Neo-Ottoman ambitions.

Turkey has been distancing itself from Israel for a while and now has even more credit with the Arab and Muslim world, which it seeks to lead. The improvement of Turkey's hegemonic credentials is bad news for Cyprus, which will find it more difficult to thwart Turkey's campaign in the Organisation of the Islamic Conference for recognition of the Turkish pseudo-state in occupied Cyprus.

On the other hand, it may mean that Israel scales back its involvement in propping up the occupation regime in northern Cyprus through economic investment and tourism. Indeed, Israel has been using this threat of upgrading its relations with the pseudo-state to keep Cyprus from too openly supporting the Palestinians. In fact, over the weekend, Israel warned Cyprus that if it permitted the ill-fated 'aid' flotilla to enter Cypriot territorial waters, Israel would encourage ferry links between Haifa and occupied Ammochostos (Famagusta). Nicosia duly shooed away the flotilla, citing 'national security' interests.

UPDATE: RIK news this evening reported statements from Cypriot MEP Eleni Theocharous, a previous participant in the Free Gaza convoys, that she did not take part this time because she was aware that the campaign had been hijacked by Turkish Islamists and infiltrated by MIT (Turkish secret service) agents out to advance Turkey's interests. She said MIT was behind attempts to use the Turkish-occupied port of Famagusta as a staging post for the flotilla in an effort to upgrade the status of the occupation regime in northern Cyprus and to draw parallels between the Israeli blockade of Gaza and the 'isolation' and 'blockade' which Turkey claims the Turkish Cypriots are enduring.

35 comments:

lastgreek said...

The usual Zionist tactics:

Shoot first, ask questions later; impose a complete news blackout in the affected areas in order to set the world news agenda.

J, I don't see how Turkey can distance itself (other than for show) from Israel. Israel is Turkey's sugar daddy just as the U.S. is Israel's sugar daddy. Come this time next year all will be basically forgoten AND military arms trade between the two pricks--Israel and Turkey, two states whick have complete disregard for international law--will have increased.

Furthermore, the Arabs, save for the Hezbollah fighters of southern Lebanon, are all losers--Egypt, Syria, Jordan...you name them. I can't see the Turks dumping Israel for the Arabs--not unless the U.S. dumps Israel, and we know that the likelihood of that happening is...well...nil.

John Akritas said...

Unless, LG, the Turks seriously believe in this independent global role for themselves they keep going on about and feel no need for the Israelis or the Americans. I also get the impression that we're watching before our eyes the demise of the American empire – they don't have the stomach for it anymore – so it may be that these old alliances and power systems are unravelling. Also, the failure of the Arabs may well be why Turkey seems such an attractive hegemonic proposition to them. Greece, of course, is an irrelevance in all this, while the game is nearly up in Cyprus, with the Turks poised to win hands down.

John Akritas said...

I should add that if you're right and the Turkish alliance with Israel is not dead, then one of the ways the Israelis might choose to mend fences with the Turks is by upgrading links with the occupation regime in Cyprus.

Hermes said...

This latest incident is fortuitous timing for Erdogan as elections are early next year. However, the new Turkish opposition leader has been just as strident in his criticism of Israel. Also, Erdogan's Neo-Ottoman ambitions will be aided by this. As John says, this will help Turkey shore up support in the Arab world for recognition of the pseudo-state. However, I am not quite sure we would want to drift to close to Israel. If American withdrawal continues there will be no one around to police problems.

As John says, we are a complete irrelevance. Also, did you notice the episodes from our "revolutionary youth" outside the Israeli embassy in Athens? If a Palestinian fly is killed our "revolutionary youth" are on the streets quick smart. If Cypriots and the rest of Greece is in danger they call anyone resisting fascists. This is the Greek youth of today!!!

lastgreek said...

J,

Your update regarding Theocharous's statements are interesting. I do hope that this is the case. It has been mentioned in the American media that the Israelis may have been duped into using excessive force. So far, no evidence has been presented by the Israelis to lend any credence to this. The capture of a few slingshots and some bags of marbles--marbles! for heaven's sake--do not constitute contraband weapons.

I say that the alliance between Israel and Turkey is not dead because of past history, especially during the last crisis--the Israeli invasion of Gaza--and because the U.S. and Israel are . . . inseparable.

The last one above is quite telling, and the main reason Turkey will not break ties with the Zionist state. Whatever Turkey's ambitions in the region, they are a big fat zero without the Americans. Turkey has no nuclear weapons; therefore, for all intent and purposes, it hardly has any say in the world stage of power politics (except when it comes to pathetic Greece, by the grace of the Americans of course). Look at North Korea, J. They are practically starving to death, and yet look at how they swing their proverbial cucumbers-- all because of a few nuclear weapons that they claim to have.

Moreover, why would the Turks, or any other non Arab country, for that matter, care to lead the Arab world? Where is the prize in that? Once Arab oil runs out or becomes economically obsolete, what do you have? A bunch of camel jockeys, that is what. Screw that, J. What the Turks covet is at least half of the Aegean Sea, world recognition of the pseudo-state in occupied nothern Cyprus, the utter destruction of all Kurdish resistance, and . . . acceptance, if possible, into the European Union so that they could pretend to be Europeans instead of the Mongols that they really are.

I totally agree about Greece's irelevance in all this. Ten million fuckin' Greeks in Greece and not one "Pericles" amongst them to lead the nation. For me, the best Greece can hope for now is a bloody civil war between the Kemalists and the Islamists.

John Akritas said...

A plausible scenario is that the Turkish Islamists (and MIT agents) on the Blue Marmara were prepared for a confrontation with the Israelis, and that such a confrontation would suit Erdogan's purposes – both for next year's elections and neo-Ottomanism. We know from the Constantinople pogrom and many instances in Cyprus how willing the Turks are to use self-inflicted provocations to advance state policy. It is ridiculous that the world – including Greece and Cyprus – is outraged at the death of these Turkish Islamist extremists. Sometimes our people seem to want to make out that Jews are our greatest threat and not the Turks.

Lots of good stuff on http://infognomonpolitics.blogspot.com/ on what Turkey's up to here.

Anonymous said...

Turkey is flexing her muscles . She is on her way of becoming the " virtual master " of the Aegean, by courtesy of our degenerate administrations. Mussolini's mare nostrum is leaning into becoming suleiman's pond. The division of Cyprus plays into the israeli political stratagems. Greek Cyprus is heavily influenced by israeli interests, financially, philosophically ( they are all dyeed trostkytes and internationalists) and " behaviorally". As long as Turkey remained inward ingrained, she was a fine ally of Israel. Now it seems the turk is " challenging" the area's interests and " status quo". This will not seerve israeli game plans. Israel will seize any opportunity to provoke the " paper tiger" turks and humiliate them on the political arena. Besides turkey's projection outward is Iran. A turk-Iranian axis, could become a valuable rook on the chessboard. The israelis can handle anything thrown at them ,with a flick of a cigarette stub. This attack on the convoy was premeditated and their consequences wholly measureed in the israeli scales. They snatched turkish vessels or vessels carrying turkish flags. The turk dog has been barking for a while. Now Erdogan's bark has risen a few more decibels, that is all; where is the bite ?? Israel's way of tempting the turk dog to show his bite following the cacophony of its bark. There is going to be no bite. Eigth months ago I visited North Korea, as part of a delegation. Don't let anyone tell you the NK are starving. They are not starving, they have everything they need; of course they don't drive BMW's, Merccs, or take holidays in Jamaica, a la Grecque; nor do they dine at Maxim's or the Otani's; luxuries are non existent. But they have a ountry which is national, not an international fornicating playground. They have relations with countries which " they only want to have relations with". It is not like our Greeks, who lick their own spittle to have " relations" with everybody, from Patagonia to Indochina .No NK is attempting to flee the country to SK. It is the democracies propaganda. I am not trying to be apologetic with NK, I could not care less, they bother no one, save the Americans, and they keep very much to themselves. I wish Greece and Greeks could take a page out of the NK ethos, minus their communism. If a conflict breaks out between north and South, the south is fried barbunia. The south spinal chord is maintained by the USA. The first thing the SK will do, in case of conflict, is flee to the USA; just like the SV did against the vietconk.
Of more interst to us is that the turk has arrived, and our politics ,which is run by marionettes, will be to seek an accomodation within the turk's orbit of influence. Since we are averse at opposing them, we have no choice but to embrace them; or they'll "embrace " us . Very sad indeed.

lastgreek said...

J,

Looks like the cat is out of the bag--the Israelis have released video footage of its soldiers being attacked with chairs and metal pipes before any of the shooting started. There is even footage of an Israeli soldier being thrown overboard. Also, the heavy presence of Turkish propaganda at protest rallies around the world is not going unnoticed. On one very popular Arab news service, it was mentioned that Turkey is "on a campaign to win Arab public opinion." What's hilarious in all this is that each side--Israeli and Turkish--is accusing the other of violating international law. Both countries are a disgust onto other nations. And there's more, J--the Turks are asking for U.S. solidarity against Israel. Ah, jeez... I think the Turks have lost their minds.

Eigth months ago I visited North Korea, as part of a delegation. Don't let anyone tell you the NK are starving. They are not starving, they have everything they need . . . -

*Cough*

Yeah... sure you did.

Here's an excerpt from Christopher Hithcens's Feb. 1, 2010 article in Slate magazine:

Visiting North Korea some years ago [2005], I was lucky to have a fairly genial "minder" whom I'll call Mr. Chae. He guided me patiently around the ruined and starving country, explaining things away by means of a sort of denial mechanism and never seeming to lose interest in the gargantuan monuments to the world's most hysterical and operatic leader-cult....

All of us who scrutinize North Korean affairs are preoccupied with one question. Do these slaves really love their chains? The conundrum has several obscene corollaries. The people of that tiny and nightmarish state are not, of course, allowed to make comparisons with the lives of others, and if they complain or offend, they are shunted off to camps that—to judge by the standard of care and nutrition in the "wider" society—must be a living hell excusable only by the brevity of its duration
-

As I've said before, "anonymous," you are either a troll or one dumbass Greek; hopefully, since the last thing the Greek nation needs is one more dumbass, it's the former.

John Akritas said...

LG: I'm not buying or sympathising with the version of events put out by the Israelis, who are clearly are bunch of creeps, to say the least; just pointing out that those involved here are not Turk humanitarians – an oxymoron, if ever there was one – but Turk jihadists, who have the full backing of the Erdogan regime as part of its plan to extend Turk influence in the Middle East and among Muslims.

As for the Americans, you do wonder how far they'll go in subordinating their national interests to Israel's. In fact, it's obvious that one of the reasons America is a declining power is because it can't extricate itself from this obsession it has with Israel. I've even noticed that neo-con Americans and American Zionists are now coming out against Turkey – http://www.frumforum.com/ – and I reckon we can expect more and more pieces critical of Turkey to appear in the Wall Street Journal, from the Washington think tanks and so on.

John Akritas said...

This article from Ardin – http://www.ardin.gr/node/3174 – reckons that the Israeli assault amounts to a setback for neo-Ottomanism because it brings Turkey into confrontation with Israel and the USA, while the neo-Ottoman strategy is to establish itself as a mediator between East and West. I'm not too sure about this. I reckon the instinct of the neo-Ottomans is Islamic solidarity and they prize this more than pandering to the Israelis and the Americans. I was also reading somewhere on the net that the Egyptians aren't too happy with Turkey's efforts to lead the Arab and Muslim world; but then the Mubarak regime is hardly in a position to challenge the Turks.

Hermes said...

There were protests here (Sydney) as well last night. A local imam who was forced to resign due to inflammatory statements and suspected terrorists links was shouting "Turkey is coming" on the podium in a main square of Sydney. These Arabs have forgotten the 800 years they spent under Ottoman rule.

The Egyptian state is unhappy because Turkey is working with the Muslim Brotherhood through parastate networks. I do not think Mubarak is worried about being challenged in the Arab world - he just wants to protect his position. Jordan will also be unhappy. Turkey is really going to irritate these regimes.

lastgreek said...

J,

I agree--the Israelis are nothing more than creeps. Watching video footage of Israelis and Turks beating each other up was quite entertaining. However, Israeli video footage clearly shows that on the Mavi Marmara--the ship that sailed from occupied Ammochostos--there was provocation, and, more importantly, it tends to support Theocharous's assertions. What I find interesting, though, is that while the Israelis are adamantly claiming that there were Turkish Islamists aboard the Marmara, they have made no mention at all of any participation of Turkish secret servive agents. I guess will have to see if this will change in the coming days. If not, I think we can easily surmise why.

Regarding the Americans, J, not one word of condemnation against Israel from the White House. And, of course, any Security Council resolution condemming Israel will surely be vetoed by the U.S. Btw, I have read some neocon opinions on the crisis, and they basically think that this is just another Israeli-Turkish crisis that will eventually come to pass. I guess they realise that there's more to gain for each country in basically keeping the current status quo; by "status quo" they mean as partners in international crime. Seriously, name two countries off the top of your head that blatantly defy international law and illegally occupy foreign lands. There you have it--partners in fuckin' crime.

Regarding the pathetic Arabs, during the Israeli invasion of Gaza last year they hardly uttered a condemnation against Israel. Egypt, Jordan, and Saudi Arabia were politically circumspect of the Israeli slaughter of civilians unforlding before their eyes. Of course they were--because they know full well who "butters their bread." AIPAC! One bad word from the American-Israeli lobby and that's it--all American aid to the Arab dictatorships stops.

lastgreek said...

There were protests here (Sydney) as well last night.-

Aha! You're from Australia. I was wondering how you happened to know so much about Toowoomba, QLD. in the Katsidis thread. :)

Hermes said...

Expect more of this in the American press:

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/articles/2010/06/01/how_do_you_say_frenemy_in_Turkish

Hermes said...

If you want to really get an understanding how dopey us Greeks have become read this thread:

http://www.dailyfrappe.com/Default.aspx?TabId=112&bc=219&Pg=Last

"Let's support Israel because Christ was from there" Yep, that is a formula for success in the modern day world!!!

John Akritas said...

H. I guess siding with Israel because Jesus was a Jew makes a difference from siding with the Arabs because the Jews killed Jesus. But what this has got to do with advancing Greek national interests, seeing what Greece can gain from this episode, is anyone's guess. Actually, I have to admit to being baffled at the way Greeks get worked up by Zionism and the Israeli occupation of Gaza – what the hell has it got to do with us, one way or the other?

LG. I, too, was entertained by the spectacle of the Turks and Israelis beating the crap out of each other; although, of course, we do not shed tears for dead Turks, especially when they are part of a lynch mob – like the one that rampaged through Constantinople in 1955 or the one that beat to death Tassos Isaac in Cyprus in 1996.

http://hellenicantidote.blogspot.com/2009/02/murders-of-tassos-isaac-and-solomos.html

lastgreek said...

What I find fascinating is how such a simple operation was so botched up by the Israelis. They surely must have known that provocateurs were aboard the main vessel, so why not take the appropriate measures? The whole idea of intercepting the vessels was to take the focus off the illegal Gaza embargo by having the vessels diverted to Israeli ports. From there, the usual, bullshit Israeli promise would be made--the cargo would be sent to Gaza. Instead the complete opposite has happened--world attention is now focused on the humanitarian crisis in Gaza. What a joke this Israel is. Then again, should we be that surprised? These our the same twits that required the use of at least a couple of dozen secret service agents recently to assassinate one Palestinian operative (or whatever the heck he was), and where their whole operation was caught on surveillance camera. Smile, you dumbfuck Mossad agents! You are on candid camera!

Actually, I have to admit to being baffled at the way Greeks get worked up by Zionism and the Israeli occupation of Gaza – what the hell has it got to do with us, one way or the other?-

Why, J? The Greeks, too, have tragically suffered--and continue to endure--dispossession and occupation. We know what it's like; we can empathize with the Palestinians. And as I said before, Turkey and Israel (with American approval, of course): partners in crimes against humanity.

John Akritas said...

LG. I don't buy your argument about why Greeks get so worked up by Zionism and the Gaza occupation, i.e. it's because we've suffered from dispossession and so on. You could just as well say we should sympathise with the Israelis because we know about genocide.

John Akritas said...

Also, LG, the Israelis may have screwed up; but they're not backing down, and this has left the Turks scrambling, not knowing how to respond. This is a real lesson in how to deal with Turk bluster and threats, which Greece would do well to learn from.

Hermes said...

Whether you believe the Israelis are right or wrong, one thing we have to admit they are manges!!!

A flotilla of SYRIZA types mixed with some Islamic provocoteurs sails towards Gazan waters and they kill nine people. Fully armed Turkish warplanes and ships sail towards Pireaus and we hold Prime Ministerial conferences and talk about building bridges.

Anonymous said...

Last Greek, your ignorance is appalling; but not all surprising. Did you visit North Corea ? Yes ? Then let's hear your comments.

Anonymous said...

Alki

What is all the fuzz about the isrealis having attacked the flotilla . There are some individuals that are blinded by " zionist phantoms". Get this message straight. The Israelis are a superpower, as a superpower they have no compunction on how to use that power. Zionist are in control of most governments in the world. Our papandreu is a half hebrew,Simitis was a full blooded hebrew, all part and parcel of the Zionist brotherhood. The rest of the anemic EU ( tinged and staffed with Zionist cronies), can howl and yell; the tukish government can scream.... and what then !!!. Nothing happens old chap. The isrealis will do as they please. They have the power and they are not scared to use it. Those who do not have the power, squeal and squirm, but nothing happens. The isreali public surrounded the turkish embassy in tel aviv and celebrated the attack to the flotilla. Nothing more need to be said. The israeli army general pronounced that his soldiers acted in splendid fashion. The israeli ambassador to south Africa in a radio interview said the attack was " a justifiable act and the deaths were humanitarian" --- maybe there is a wrong translation here---. Erdogan stopped his rant against the israelis, following the celebration in tel aviv. I am waiting with bated breath what the turkish will do next.

lastgreek said...

Last Greek, your ignorance is appalling; but not all surprising. Did you visit North Corea ?-

No--I haven't had the pleasure of visiting North Korea . . . and neither have you.

Yes? Then let's hear your comments.-

No. Let's hear Christopher Hitchen's comments, someone who has actually been to that pathetic country. Here are a few more snippets from the Hitch:

It would be truer to say that the Democratic People's Republic of North Korea, as it calls itself, is a concentration camp. It would be even more accurate to say, in American idiom, that North Korea is a slave state.-

In North Korea, every person is property and is owned by a small and mad family with hereditary power. Every minute of every day, as far as regimentation can assure the fact, is spent in absolute subjection and serfdom. The private life has been entirely abolished. One tries to avoid cliché, and I did my best on a visit to this terrifying country in the year 2000, but George Orwell's 1984 was published at about the time that Kim Il Sung set up his system, and it really is as if he got hold of an early copy of the novel and used it as a blueprint. ("Hmmm … good book. Let's see if we can make it work.")-

Actually, North Korea is rather worse than Orwell's dystopia.-

It is a famine state as well as a slave state.-

I don't usually bother replying to trolls, but I am under the impression now that you just might be a dumbass Greek afterall.

PS links to Hitch's articles on the famine state of North Korea:

http://www.slate.com/id/2117846

http://www.slate.com/id/2243112

lastgreek said...

LG. I don't buy your argument about why Greeks get so worked up by Zionism and the Gaza occupation, i.e. it's because we've suffered from dispossession and so on.-

For me, it's a question of justice and human rights, J. Why do you think Greeks protest the Zionist state then?

You could just as well say we should sympathise with the Israelis because we know about genocide.-

Except that we Greeks--unlike the Israelis--have not commited ethnic cleansing (including rape and murder), nor are we illegally occupying another people's land. For all our faults, and we have many, we are not anything like the disgusting Israelis.


PS "Turks" can be substituted for "Israelis" above.

lastgreek said...

J, it would have been cool if you had titled this thread "Pirates of the Caribbean." :)

lastgreek said...

Whether you believe the Israelis are right or wrong, one thing we have to admit they are manges!!!-

H, if Greece were suckling at America's lactating tit, like Israel,...

lastgreek said...

"Pirates of the Mediterranean"

lastgreek said...

Get this message straight. The Israelis are a superpower, as a superpower they have no compunction on how to use that power.-

The United States is a superpower. The Israelis are just another rogue state--a nuclear armed, lunatic, rogue state.

If I can loosely paraphrase Balzac, for every Israeli crime there is an American thumbs up behind it.


PS Each and every day, the American taxpayer dishes out (unbeknown to him, of course)about $10,000,000 to the Israeli welfare mooch state.

lastgreek said...

Also, LG, the Israelis may have screwed up...-

The Israelis are very good at screwing up. Since there 1982 invasion of Lebanon, it's been one unmitigated disaster over another.


...but they're not backing down...-

That's because their sugar daddy says they don't have to.

... and this has left the Turks scrambling, not knowing how to respond.-

So far, the Turks seem to be having their cake and eating it too. I don't like it one bit. I hope this changes, but the Israelis have yet to publicly state that their were Turkish secret service agents aboard the Marmara.


This is a real lesson in how to deal with Turk bluster and threats, which Greece would do well to learn from.-

I would say that the real lesson here is that it's better to be proactive than reactive. The Turks took the initiative, I'll give them that.

lastgreek said...

No edit button :(

"Since their 1982..." not "Since there..."

"Hitchens's" not "Hitchen's"

...

lastgreek said...

A befuddled Turk on some English speaking Turkish blog asks why Turkey is not now at war with Israel. If Greeks had boarded the Marmara instead of Israelis, he continues, Turkey would now be at war with Greece.

The befuddled Turk has made an excellent observation. Why, indeed, befuddled Turk!

John Akritas said...

Come on, LG: you're not seriously saying that Greeks are more sensitive than others to international justice and human rights. Look at the way Greeks treat each other, then tell me Greeks are world champions of international justice and human rights. And why aren't Greeks screaming about Darfur or Tibet? No, I reckon Palestine is a cause celebre for some Greeks because it fits in with this Marxist, anti-imperialist rhetoric that dominates political discourse in the country.

Also, we Greeks have not been fairies when it comes to creating the nation state and we've had to get rid of or assimilate our Albanians, Muslims and Slavs. This is how ALL nation states were built, though these methods passed after the 2WW.

I admit that my initial reaction to this episode was that this is a boost for Turkey and neo-Ottomanism; but now I'm coming round to the idea that what's been revealed is the limitations of neo-Ottomanism, and that if you face down the Turks they struggle for a response. I agree with the Turk who said if this were Greece, Turkey would be at war – and this is because Greece shows weakness to the Turks and capitulates at the first sign of trouble; although I wonder if Greece extended its territorial water to 12 miles would this really be a casus belli for the Mongols?

lastgreek said...

Come on, LG: you're not seriously saying that Greeks are more sensitive than others to international justice and human rights.-

No more, no less than the rest of the civilized world.

No, I reckon Palestine is a cause celebre for some Greeks because it fits in with this Marxist, anti-imperialist rhetoric that dominates political discourse in the country.-

J, the whole world---save for the U.S., and some Pacific atoll islands---condemns Israel. It's not a Marxist thing.

Also, we Greeks have not been fairies when it comes to creating the nation state and we've had to get rid of or assimilate our Albanians, Muslims and Slavs-

The Albanians, Muslims, and Slavs came into Greek territory; we did not go into theirs. Big difference. And those barbarians can thank their lucky stars for coming into contact with us Greeks. We gave them everything: education, religion, history, civilization ... you name it.

J, someone posted this thread on www.cyprus-forum.com, and he was castigated by a TC boy for it. What kind of site is that? Too many TC pricks for my liking.

John Akritas said...

LG: I don't know much about this Cyprus Forum, though the guy who runs it seems to have roots in the same village as me in Cyprus; and, of course, any time I'm insulted by a Turk I am deeply flattered. God forbid I should say anything they agree with. Generally, I have found any attempt to engage with Turkish Cypriots about Cyprus pointless, since all they are capable of is repeating the propaganda they've been fed all these years.

And, for me, this piece by SYRIZA's Panayiotis Lafazanis sums up well the Marxist, anti-imperialist discourse I was talking about and the hopeless, ludicrous foreign policy it suggests for Greece.

http://infognomonpolitics.blogspot.com/2010/06/blog-post_2783.html

Anonymous said...

John Akritas said...
Unless, LG, the Turks seriously believe in this independent global role for themselves they keep going on about and feel no need for the Israelis or the Americans. I also get the impression that we're watching before our eyes the demise of the American empire – they don't have the stomach for it anymore – so it may be that these old alliances and power systems are unravelling. Also, the failure of the Arabs may well be why Turkey seems such an attractive hegemonic proposition to them. Greece, of course, is an irrelevance in all this, while the game is nearly up in Cyprus, with the Turks poised to win hands down.


America had problems even at its best the influence comes from cash rather then military might take korea and vietnam as examples of American ineptitude a China torn apart by civil war and Japanese occupation managed to fight America to a standstill with a SMALLER ARMY according to the intel reports at the time there were only 150 thousand chinese combat troops in the initial offensive yet they pushed back twice as many un forces with full naval and air superiority and that was when China had 1 percent of Americas industrial output i dont think America would fair any better today in fact if push came to shove China would remove them from Korea within mili seconds.